WS-6-MINI Looses connectivity to AP, restored after reboot

[Eagle12]

I have a WS-6-Mini running firmware v1.4.7 powering two Ubiquiti radios, a 24v Rocket M900 and a 48v Rocket M5 Titanium. I began having problems with the Rocket M900 going offline. Port bouncing the M900 did not bring it back online. However if I rebooted the WS-6-Mini the M900 would come back online for a day or two before going offline again. So I replaced the Rocket M900, same thing. Bounce the switch and it comes right up. Port bounce has no effect.

I'm using 13-19 Watts out of 100 on the meter at the top (switch is powered by the AC power adapter). I notice the Rocket M900 averages about 4 watts, but will spiketo 8-9.5 Watts every 10 seconds or so. Seems high but I don't know what is normal. Any ideas what may be the issue?

I'm a newbie to Netonix switches so any insight is appreciated.

Doug

[Julian]

your power consumption is approximately in line with what I see as normal - 20w should be no issue.

Are you leaving ports set to autonegotiate, and if so, what happens when you force 100m-F on the m900's interface?

[Eagle12]

Julian I've tried 100m-f and 10m-f same result. However I may have figured out something. I ran the cable diagnostics and it reported a cable short on a pairs 3 and 4. However when I ran cable diagnostics on the Rocket M5 Titanium it also said short on pairs 3 & 4 and it's been running fine for a year.

[Julian]

That is likely because they intentionally short those pairs in that device so that they don't have to deliver power through a center tap - common practice on the Rockets. As long as there isn't a cross-pair short, I don't believe that's the correct direction to head (i.e. i believe layer 1 is implemented correctly)

Are you logging any packet errors or pause frames on that port?
what is the status of flow control on that port?
is the m900 in a ptp or ptmp application?
What firmware are you running on the m900?

are a few of my questions.

[sirhc]

This is a GOOD POST to read: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1178#p8809

COMMON QUESTIONS:

Question: Can I power 802.3af/at devices such as cameras and phones with Netonix Switches?

Answer: YES, but since they are a "passive" POE switch you will have to manually turn on POE for the port. Most 802.3af/at devices use 48V NOT 48VH. Never use 48VH until you verify your device will accept power on all 4 pairs.

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Question: I see a cross-short, is that bad?

Answer: YES, never turn POE on any port where you see a cross short as that means 1 wire from one pair is shorted to another wire of another pair which is a DEAD SHORT and will fry the switch port. Cross-Short is about the only real bad situation that will surely fry a port.

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Question: Why do I see abnormal termination when I do a cable diagnostics?

Answer: Because every manufacturer does not follow the proper design specs so when the device is unpowered it is actually doing the cable test into the device electronics and every device will report differently. They "should" report OK, OK , OK , OK once the device is powered up however some Ethernet surge protectors will always report abnormal termination.

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Question: Why do I see short on pairs 3 and 4 on a of devices especially UBNT airMAX 10/100 gear.

Answer: Because every manufacturer does not follow the proper design specs and use a 4 channel Ethernet Transformer designed for POE with a center tab for each pair. Since pair 3 and 4 is not needed to carry data with 10/100 only links they use them for power only which allows them to use a cheaper 2 channel transformer without a center tap for pairs 1 and 2. They then connect the 2 wires from each pair to the board skipping the need for a transformer with a center tap so the 2 wires from pair 3 are connected directly to the board shorted together for positive and the 2 wires from pair 4 are shorted together directly on the board for negative.


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Question: Why do you say "DO NOT PLUG CABLES INTO LIVE POE PORTS".

Answer: Our switches are "passive" POE which means if POE is enabled on a port the power is live so if you plug in a cable that is shorted or the piece of equipment is bad you will damage the port in the switch and this damage is not covered under warranty.

You own the switch, you can power it up under water if you want to but do not expect that to be covered under warranty same as
shorted ports are NOT covered under warranty

.
Look, to be able to deliver .75A and 1.5A @ 55C we have to size the Polyfuse to not trip while delivering those watts at that temperature which means if the switch is in an environment that is less than 55C the Polyfuse will not trip until way beyond that level. The Polyfuses are used more for fire protection from the result of a dead short and since you can not find Ethernet Transformers to handle more than 1A per pair this means that the chances are extremely high that plugging in a shorted cable or bad device to a live port will result in the damaging of the port and it will cost you money.

You can not compare our switches to "active" POE switches which means that power is applied once the switch negotiates with the device and at that point the switch knows the cabling is not shorted and applies power. The problem with "active" POE switches is 802.3af limits you to 15W and 802.3at limits you to 25W which will not power things like airFIBER radios or deliver 1.5A to a MINI switch.

I have been a WISP for over 20 years now and I KNOW that we all make mistakes and crimp ends wrong from time to time and we are sometimes in a rush and plug the connectors in without being careful they are straight.

If you turn POE on after you plug in the cable the switch will attempt to determine if there is a cross-short and prevent you from making a mistake if you leave POE SMART enabled. POE SMART is not perfect but it catches 99% of the problems and saves a lot of switch ports.
If you turn the POE on after you plug the cable in the connector is firmly seated and straight with no chance of crossing pins and shorting out your port and possibly damaging your device.

Also there is a possibility that when you plug in a shorted cable or one with a bad device that too much power is drawn and can cause your switch to not only damage a port but reboot the switch causing your tower to go down while the reboot is in progress.

Plug a shorted cable into our switch and MOST times you fry that port and the rest of the switch is fine and will continue to operate. Do that to a ToughSWITCH and most times the whole switch ios dead, at least that has been my experience at my WISP over the years. Feel free to try it yourself.

If you want to plug cables into live ports it is your switch do as you want as this damage is easy to spot when you RMA it and we will not fix it for free.

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Question: Can I power this device with Netonix.

Answer: Our switches are "passive" POE which means if POE is enabled on a port the power is live so if you plug in a cable that is shorted or the piece of equipment is bad or has an incompatible polarity PIN OUT you will damage the port in the switch and probably the equipment, this damage is not covered under warranty.

There are 4 Pairs and 8 PINs in an Ethernet Cable:
Pair 1: White Orange.(PIN 1 ) & Orange.(PIN 2) is POSITIVE
Pair 2: White Green...(PIN 3) & Green...(PIN 6) is NEGATIVE
Pair 3: White Blue.....(PIN 4) & Blue.....(PIN 5) is POSITIVE
Pair 4: White Brown..(PIN 7) & Brown...(PIN 8) is NEGATIVE

24V POE Option @ .75A - constant draw can surge/spike to 1A:
802.3af/at MODE B [i]pinout[/i]
Pair 3 / PINs 4, 5 are POSITIVE
Pair 2 & 4 / PINs 3, 6, 7, 8 are NEGATIVE

48V POE Option @.75A - constant draw can surge/spike to 1A:
802.3af/at MODE B [i]pinout[/i]
You would use this option to power most 802.3af/at devices like IP Phones and Cameras
Pair 3 / PINs 4, 5 are POSITIVE
Pair 2 & 4 / PINs 3, 6, 7, 8 are NEGATIVE

24VH POE Option @1.5A - constant draw can surge/spike to 2A:
802.3af/at MODE A & MODE B [i]pinout combined[/i]
Pair 1 & 3 / PINs 1, 2, 4, 5 are POSITIVE
Pair 2 & 4 / PINs 3, 6, 7, 8 are NEGATIVE

48VH POE Option @1.5A - constant draw can surge/spike to 2A:
802.3af/at MODE A & MODE B [i]pinout combined[/i]
Pair 1 & 3 / PINs 1, 2, 4, 5 are POSITIVE
Pair 2 & 4 / PINs 3, 6, 7, 8 are NEGATIVE

So now that you know what the PIN OUT is (which is in our Spec Sheet on page 17 and in the product description on our web store) all you need to do is look at the spec sheet from your device and see which POE option you can use.

If they do not specify the PIN OUT polarity break out a multi-meter and but one end off of a patch cable and strip the wires and figure it out on your own.

Also if they have a bridge rectifier circuit like MIMOSA the device will swap the polarity the way it wants it.

WARNING - If your equipment is not specifically designed to accept power on all 4 Pairs do NOT use a VH POE option.

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[tomtech]

I was just about to leave a post when I read this. we have a WS-6 at a client. it has two routers plugged in and powers a single UBNT antenna. the power to the switch is not using POE but using the DC in port and a provided Netonix PS. All good for about 6 months. upgraded to 1.4.7rc18. All good. Then the switch locks up. No connectivity in or out. had to visit the client and power-cycle. All good. then two weeks later it locks up again. Power cycle, All good.
Just wondering if we have another issue or if I should go up to 1.4.7 and hold for a while. I have a spare in stock, but swapping now doesn't give me any input as to the problem. The switch uses 10.3w on the POE max. I can't read the log because it clears after reset and I'm not grabbing it yet.
Anyway, if you have some help/direction please let me know.
Thanks
T

[sirhc]

Well we always say upgrade to the "latest" which is v1.4.8rc6 I think.

If it happens again swap out the unit and see if that unit has same issue or RMA it if you like.